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“You say concealed carry I say Trayvon Martin. Police officers make mistakes all the time. We spend six months in the police academy, six months of field training and ongoing training on a regular basis and the fact is once in a while we’re going to shoot someone with a cellphone; we’re going to shoot somebody with a flashlight and none of that is okay. But now you take John Q. Civilian, you give them six weeks or 10 weeks of training and you say ‘have at it?’ The fact is more guns are not the solution to the firearm gun violence problem in this country. Less guns and reasonable gun laws are. And just because it’s 49 states to one doesn’t mean the state of Illinois is wrong on that one.” – Chicago Police Superintendent Garry McCarthy [via gunsnfreedom.com]

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121 COMMENTS

  2. From the first sentence…. Yes, thank goodness we have concealed carry rights or Trayvon Martin would have beat George Zimmerman’s face in more severely or killed him.

  3. Isn’t he just precious.
    To summarize: people should not protect themselves because we’re trained to investigate their death.

  4. He says Trayvon Martin, I say he picked a poor example. I’m guessing he didn’t follow the trial very well.

    • Seems to me that the TM attack on GZ ending in TM’s demise (rather than GZ’s demise) comes closer to the definition of a successful defensive gun use than anything else. It wasn’t until politicians got involved that things got really messy.

    • Fact-immune. I like that phrase. Yes, in the gun debate, and many other debates, it appears that there is a subspecies of Homo sapiens, that when confronted with irrefutable facts and data, their minds mount a massive immune response. It’s too bad that there doesn’t seem to be a cure for it and that it’s not a fatal affliction.

  6. Sooo, do they cover “not shooting streetlights” in this intensive training regimen? Cause I think Garry might have missed that day…

    • Apparently they also teach how to be a somewhat drunk @ss bullying the local gendarmerie on NJ’s Garden State Parkway, too. Being NJ, though, that’s no biggie for an out-of-state cop.

  7. Spoken like a political appointee and mouthpiece for the mayor. At the ground level LEO say differently, the ones I have spoken to love the help.

  8. I wonder how he explains the numerous, successful defensive gun uses each year by those with carry permits?

    • The high crime rate in Chicago is caused by all those people legally defending themselves in the rest of the country. If the other states adopted Chicago’s laws, its crime rate wouldn’t look as bad comparatively.

  9. When his city has more murders than KIAs in Afghanistan, he must be right about “gun violence”
    /sarcasm

  10. He outlines his political agenda in the first two sentences – Link the shooting of Trayvon Martin to shooting errors by law enforcement. Make it political and appeal to emotions.

    Ignore the facts, and ignore the data which shows that police officers have more shooting errors than Mere Mortals.

    • That’s generally because the “Mere Mortals” practice more often. Ands cops are humans too, most believing the same as most of us who can stand the 2A attack….

      • I suppose CCW holders are better trained than cops. However I’m not confident that handgun owners are better trained than cops.
        Using DGU stats to compare cops and CCW holders is not – repeat NOT – an apples to apples comparison. DGU situations for CCW holders should, by their very nature, have much less uncertainty than police DGU situations. Put another way, CCW holders can often avoid unpleasant situations where as cops must often engage with unpleasant situations. Therefore, it shouldn’t be surprising that outcomes are better for CCW holders.

      • Not that anything this moron says is actually relevant, but of all that time (one full year) spent training Chicago police, what percentage, exactly, is spent teaching firearms and what percentage is spent teaching how to bully citizens while staying within the letter of the law? Certainly police put themselves into dangerous situations on purpose and find it necessary to use their weapons, which results in misuse of weapons, but how does that justify refusing to allow other citizens to exercise their natural, civil ad constitutionally protected right to self-defense?

        I live in Washington, a “Shall Issue” state. There are NO training requirements. If you are not subject to certain legal prohibitions against carrying a pistol the permit is yours, by right, as per Washington state constitution. Period. And yet I do not see or hear a lot of news reports of CPL holders having negligent discharges or shooting innocent people by accident, or random dogs, or instigating gunfights, for that matter.

    • But trayvon wasn’t in a dog crate when Zimmerman shot him. He was in commission of a felony.

      I guess that is why they get six months at the academy, so they are able to differentiate between a threat and a whoop ass.

    • That is a pretty impressive record of abuse of authority and unprofessional behavior. That doesn’t happen by accident, you have to be trying to act like that.

      • Yeah. It usually takes a lot for me to use the “human excrement” label with somebody, but this guy takes the cake. If any of us regular little people did 1/2 of what he’s done, we’d be in prison. Not him though, he gets a paycheck and a badge. The streetlight assassin.

  13. welcome to the hellhole that i live in. with this guy and other idiots in charge, only thing that will happen is more crime and more poverty and an increased downturn in the economy. wish i could just uproot and leave. tell your kids never to go to lawschool. god, i HATE this place!!

    • Yep, don’t go to law school. Just do six months at a police academy. It apparently makes you a god. You receive an official Approved to Enjoy a Bill of Rights card, and the bennies are terrific.

      Who is not in awe of the rhetorical skill displayed by a guy who starts out admitting he and his occasionally shoot a guy because he has a cell phone or flashlight in his hand?

  14. When Illinois isn’t losing 500+ black folks a year to murder and gang violence, they can lecture the rest of us on gun laws. Actually, I strike that. They can never lecture us on gun law.

      • They believe the court is wrong, and the cops are going to make it impossible for citizens to use the right the courts have stated time and time again that they have. Its their moral obligation after all to tell people how to live their lives being superior and all.

      • When I read your post all I could think of was Meatloaf in the background singing “Now don’t be sad, cause 0 out of 50 ain’t bad.” Doesn’t have quite the same ring to it.

  17. P.S. a year of training in something ain’t sh!t. The subject mattter in that year is likely more about protecting the department from liability issues and how to avoid mussing up my dead body for the detectives after I’ve been killed in a state that has rendered me defenseless.

  18. this ass hat is in DENIAL stage he can’t fix his problem so he points the finger at everyone else…..nice try ass hat …

  20. Forget “civilians”, if six months in the police academy and six months of field
    training isn’t enough to keep LEOs from shooting the innocent; I definitely
    don’t want them to have guns much less actual military hardware.

  22. Police are charged with the task of maintaining order. I see their sidearm as part of the force continuum that protects them while carrying out their duties. Cops are rarely around during the commission of a crime.
    Armed citizens *are* around during the commission of a crime against themselves. It makes simple logistical sense that they’d actually do at least a comparable job of identifying who is the threat, and taking appropriate action.

  23. I will leave the Chicago cops suck to others. I just want to point out how stupid this statement is from the standpoint of liability. He has just put everyone on notice that the men under his command are authorized to shoot people on a “I just don’t like him” basis. It is a statement he cannot retract to escape liability. So all McCarthy has done is set the stage for a mega-million dollar payout the next time the cops shoot anyone without sufficient justification. The city really has no choice but to fire him not that they will.

  24. I’m surprised he didn’t say Amado Dialo for an example of cops’ shooting the cell phone user. Oh wait, that was NYC.

    • Your rights are not “granted by” The Constitution, those are your ‘Natural Rights’. Your rights are <b.guaranteed by The Constitution.

      Not to be too pedantic, but it is important.

      • Yup, a law which denies a natural right is not lawful. Mandatory (forced funding of) abortions, forced relocation, seizure of property, duty to retreat, and denial to the right to freely practice religion that does not infringe on other’s natural rights as examples.

  26. The so-called armed intelligentsia once again proves incapable of engaging an argument, reverting to the usual inane collection of coarse, unoriginal insults, ad hominem attacks and blatant nonsense. I know I will now be attacked for daring to include myself apart from the drivel. But this is now par for the course at TTAG which seems to have built itself an audience of hysterics incapable of engaging without insulting. Pathetic but predictable.

    • “… once again proves incapable of engaging an argument,”

      Well now that you have framed it in those terms I am not so sure any of us want to even try to engage you in any way. You can’t complain about a group of people painting with very broad brushstrokes when you yourself paint with such a broad brushstroke. Would you like to be the pot or the kettle?

    • How does one engage a willfully stupid political hack who denies the what the data show? There is no engagement to be had with such a person.

    • So Herewegoagain. I counted the responses that called him a “tool” and “stupid” which add up to 7 responses out of at this point is 39 total responses.

      The rest of the responses are simply observations and statements or belief and facts,; so go ahead and use hyperbole, lies and misstatements to paint all gun owners to be like yourself. Gun grabbers have only these type of attacks at their disposal; facts, history and natural law are on our side; in the end, we will prevail over the tyranny people like you represent.

      • It’s easier for Herewegoagain to cherry pick a few of the statements that suit his/her agenda for the purpose of smearing the group as a whole rather than address the topic. Perhaps this person should take some of their own advice rather than proving they’re “incapable of engaging an argument”.

    • The armed intelligentsia require an actual ARGUMENT for there to be any discussion. Since that’s what you ask for..

      “You say concealed carry, I say Trayvon Martin”
      Ever hear the song “Don’t take your guns to town” by Johnny Cash? It’s about a dumb kid who gets himself killed in a barfight, even though his momma tried to warn him away from fighting. It was a cautionary tale, moral of which being “if you get in a fight, you can die” For some reason we’ve developed an idea in society that actions don’t have consequences, and that you can get into a fistfight with a random stranger and you’ll both walk away just fine. Fun fact, more people are bludgeoned to death than are killed with firearms, and there is such a thing as a one punch homicide. Both of them could have walked away from that confrontation before it turned physical, but once it did, odds were that one of them was going to be going to the hospital at least. Leaving right or wrong out of the equation, concealed carry just made sure Zimmerman was the one to walk away from that situation.

      “Police officers make mistakes all the time.”
      And rarely are prosecuted or receive serious repercussion for their actions. Point being?

      “We spend six months in the police academy, six months of field training and ongoing training on a regular basis and the fact is once in a while we’re going to shoot someone with a cellphone; we’re going to shoot somebody with a flashlight and none of that is okay.”
      Could have fooled me. Police are rarely held accountable, and in many cases are less trained than a handgun enthusiast, particularly when local PD require officers to pay for their own range time and ammunition. Train just enough to qualify with your weapon every 6 months is a rule of thumb.

      “But now you take John Q. Civilian, you give them six weeks or 10 weeks of training and you say ‘have at it?”

      Police officers have a much more complex job, therefore it requires constant training. A civilian should draw his weapon only if in imminent danger of death or serious injury. Very simple. You don’t have to sort out who the good and bad guys are as a civilian. It’s a very straightforward “I don’t want to die” reaction. Police officers are entering situations with little or no real firsthand knowledge of the situation, the people involved, etc. There are a lot of unknown factors that make their job quite difficult, and mistakes more likely. At any rate, apples and oranges.

      “The fact is more guns are not the solution to the firearm gun violence problem in this country. Less guns and reasonable gun laws are. And just because it’s 49 states to one doesn’t mean the state of Illinois is wrong on that one.”

      “Reasonable gun laws” is his way of saying “no one but the police should have weapons” and that we should be content to meekly stand by until/if the police get to the location of the crime being commited to our persons. So yes. That’s greeted with derision. That makes a mockery of the intelligence of the average civilian, our rights, and the Constitution. He can go play hide-and-go-(censored)-himself.

    • It’s interesting that you use an ad hominem attack on us while accusing us of using ad hominem attacks, Just sayin’, pinhead.

    • You know as gun owners we should just be sanguine that someday We the people will be as enlightened as our betters who are in office and positions of power in this country and that our railing against their wishes with our foul language and harsh comments is merely a misunderstanding as to our place in life. Who are we the people to judge these much wiser individuals who know what is best for us lowly servants. We should simply accept what our leaders say as gospel and seek to implement their ideas as swiftly as humanly possible.

  27. Just like Chicago is a Light onto the Nations regarding finance, integrity, racial equality, citizen safety…

    As a matter of fact, I can’t think of a single area where Chicago is not a good example … of what not to do.

    • I recall reading somewhere the number is about 40.

      Nationwide.

      I am still looking for somewhere/somebody for attribution.

      • Still can’t find a good source of information, most sites link back to one questionable group, the Violence Prevention Center (http://www.vpc.org/ccwkillers.htm)

        Depending on which so-called data you use there is between 200 and 500 deaths attributed to permit holders nationwide since 2007. The data doesn’t seem to differentiate anything other than death by firearm because the Zimmerman case is included in the numbers since he had a Florida CCW permit.

        In other words…. statistically very very low.

      • I would say that the very fact that the data, in this Internet age, is so difficult to find fairly SCREAMS that the number of incidents are insignificant.

  29. “But now you take John Q. Civilian…”

    Why is it that police refuse to accept the fact that they are civilians? They are a part of the “civilian” system whether they like it or not. If they screw up badly enough, they go to the same courts as we do. They are supposed to live under the same laws we do (and I know, they don’t. But that is another topic). And when they are off duty, they have the exact same rules as we do.

    How is this not “civilian”?

    • Hey, apparently you forget the Chief and his studied at an academy for six months. Six Months. I think the next time he’s in a scrape he should be defended by counsel that only did law school for six months, Sounds fair.

  30. It’s a good thing you have statistics on your side and all bro-ham, or not. Love how lefties keep altering history on “the rabid dog who was hunted down”. Just a sweet young boy he was! Gunned down by a vigilante hispan….racist white guy.

  31. <just for S&G>
    “we’re going to shoot someone with a cellphone; we’re going to shoot somebody with a flashlight”

    Gee, I didn’t know that they’d perfected those shooting cellphones and flashlights. <BSEG>
    </just for S&G>

    * BSEG = Big Sh!t-Eatin’ Grin

  32. I wish there were logic police in the Chicago police department.
    Fallacy, straw man
    Police officers get a call on the radio with incomplete information and have to assess on arrival. The chance of incorrect determination of the situation is high.
    In a self-defence scenario, we are IN it from the get go.
    We know who the bad guy is.
    The police are intervening all the time so we have to give them some slack that they will get it wrong but it is a completely different argument that we will mis-identify someone that is actually attacking us.

  33. He makes a good point that just because a majority says something doesn’t make it a good idea…for example, just because a majority wants severe restrictions on gun rights doesn’t make it a good idea…unfortunately he only understands Tyranny of the majority when it’s opposing him.

    He also forgets that the 6 month police academy is not 24/7 firearms training, and that most ccw permit holders spend equal to or more time keeping up what is a very perishable skill, while a good portion of LE are not interested in firearms and simply train for qualification.

    • “He makes a good point that just because a majority says something doesn’t make it a good idea…”

      This would be valid if this were some democratically voted on issue, but we are talking about a natural, civil and constitutionally protected right not subject to being infringed by the federal government nor reversed by popular vote. You COULD propose another amendment repealing or modifying the Second Amendment, but good luck with that.

      • I say, if we’re going to go to all the bother of actually amending the Constitution, we should start with the repeal of the 16th.

  34. There’s a big difference between a man with a gun and a man with a gun and a badge. If a cop accidentally shoots an innocent person he gets a month paid vacation while his colleagues clear him of any wrongdoing, if you or I shoot an innocent person we go to prison for the rest of our lives. You can see why a civilian might be a little more trigger shy than a LEO.

  36. McCarthy just equated the self-defense shooting of a young man committing agg assault to police error. Perhaps a better example would have been to equate the shooting of the innocent resident of a wrong house raid to police err… oh wait.

  37. So what are the people paying for? This shows what police forces think of the average citizen. Get a badge and suck the taxpayer tit, then wallow over and take away their right to self defense, then shoot them. Thanks….to serve themselves and protect their pensions.

  38. “And just because it’s 49 states to one doesn’t mean the state of Illinois is wrong on that one.” Chicago Police Superintendent Garry McCarthy”

    …And it certainly doesn’t mean they are right either.

    “The fact is more guns are not the solution to the firearm gun violence problem in this country. Less guns and reasonable gun laws are.”

    Your typical politically correct statements meant to make Mr. McCarthy and Chicago home owner associations feel good. Less guns and reasonable gun laws are in fact not a solution at all to the US “violence” problem. “Gun violence” does not exist. “Violence” exists and violent people use the gun as their tool of choice. Suppose you actually do take the guns out of criminals hands (which isn’t going to happen). They would use another weapon to kill someone – If they are going to kill someone they will. Why are we addressing “gun deaths” and not just “deaths”? A deterrent to criminals intent on killing are stiffer penalties and armed would-be victims. Not the nanny state taking the gun out of the hands of everyone. “No” says the nanny. “Now go play with your toys – this is not a toy.”

    The government is not my babysitter.

  39. Police chiefs are politicians first and foremost. Then bureaucrats. Somewhere in there is a history of actual law enforcement. Usually brief. That’s the context in which I view his remarks…….pfffftt!

    • The trial doesn’t matter. Trayvon Martin was a saint and OJ Simpson was framed. Everybody knows that, because Jesse Jackson says it’s true.

  41. It’s not about how good a shot I am, Chief, it’s about the basic fact that I have the Right to defend myself and my Family and, if the situation requires it, other victims of deadly criminal attack. Period. I accept I may go to jail for exercising my Right to Defend myself and others, but I will always insist I have that Right, and as a moral, rational Human Being it is my choice to exercise it when I deem it appropriate or necessary (and I accept the consequences).
    If your Police Officers make mistakes despite their “extensive training” that only goes to show that in the heat of a dire situation People can make mistakes. It happens and that’s a fact. Another fact is that your Police Officers have a low probability of intervening in a criminal attack in a timely enough window to make me want to put my Life and well-being and those of my Family in your Police Officers’ hands. Period.
    So, I won’t tell you how to train your Police Officers, and you don’t tell me I have no right to defend myself and others, if I need to. Period.

  42. Says the mouthpiece of the Chicago, IL political anti-firearm machine.
    Wonder when the last time his a$$ actually was out on patrol looking
    to arrest criminals?

  43. $20 says he stole his “talking points” from that crazy a$$ priest Phlegm or Pflager or whatever. I heard him saying the same thing on a youtube video linking the ccw law to TM’s death. In fact, wouldn’t it be a hoot to show that Gerry stole the speech? Great way to force a resignation. Just saying.

  44. His statement would be great if Chicago had the lowest crime and gun violence in the nation.

    What a “putts” !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    His position would be best served if he concentrated his efforts on criminals instead of polishing his plush office chair. Put on a uniform and hit the streets !!

    • “the need to repair the department’s credibility.” Of course. Don’t repair the department’s procedure, don’t teach the Dirty Harries to not shoot unarmed innocent civilians, just repair the department’s fvcking credibility.

      I have to go throw up now.

  46. A chief of police that works for a politician that is as antigun as his old boss the prez,this chief is saying what his boss wants him to say.This guy is a puppet that should retire and drink himself to death,yes I have read somewhere that he is a fish in a bottle.Makes you wonder how the cops in Chicago can do their job,with a PC chief like this,but I guess that is why most of their shooting go unsolved because they don’t want to face the gangsters,because maybe they are scared of them?Be prepared and ready.Keep your powder dry.

  48. If one person says you’re a douchebag there’s room for discussion. If 49 people out of 50 say you’re a douche, then you’re a douche.

  49. Normal “civilians” shouldn’t have guns or try to defend themselves because cops have the protection of the union. They can wrongfully kill someone and go on paid vacation before being “reinstated”. A “civilian” rightfully kills someone and their life as they know it is over.

    In the real world cops responding don’t know the situation, treat everyone as a threat, and make “mistakes” while a CCW-holder knows exactly what is going on because they’re there the entire time and have a vested interest in the right outcome. Cops with guns is far scarier than the law-abiding people, but obviously the police chief of the most corrupt PD in the nation would never admit that. It’s just a pack of wolves trying to make their next meals easier to get, nothing wrong with that now is there you defenseless sheep of Chicago?

  51. We the John Q public, if we get it wrong we go to jail, we loose our right to cary or even own a firearm. We the public are not thugs with badges who at worst loose our job. We do more training in the proper use of a firearm and how to hit what we are shooting at. We do not have a “union” backing us if we are wrong.The laws surrounds our use of deadly force are a lot stricter then the police. And people wonder why I do not trust them.

  53. “… when somebody turns with a firearm in their hand the officer does not have an obligation to wait to get shot to return fire and we’re going to have tragedies as a result of that.”

    How about the officer waiting ’til someone actually fires on them before “returning” fire?

    Just a thought.

      • South Park is hard to beat. Hell would be a contradiction for statists because they believe that by getting ‘Big Gov’ more power, they will paradoxically attain more individual freedom.

        • Well, I’m pretty sure that there are religionists who believe that the key to heaven is abject obedience to the God of Power, which is kind of the opposite of Free Will.

          If that’s the case, I certainly don’t want to go there and be surrounded by white on white on white, excruciatingly boring, self-righteous prigs. I want to go to where all the fun people are!

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